The SWE Spotlight returns here to SLTD Wrestling with the man known as “Tenacious” Johnny Lyons! For those of you who have been keeping up with this series of interviews that I’ve been lucky enough to do with a LOT of the SWE roster, Johnny’s name crops up more often than not as someone who his fellow wrestlers love getting in the ring with and learning from.
I was able to catch up with Johnny ahead of this weekend’s final SWE shows of 2012 in Dundee on Friday night (High Voltage), where he’s putting the SWE Future Division Championship on the line against Martyn Stallyon, and Saturday night in Alyth, where the 5th annual “Season’s Beatings” event takes place from the Town Hall.
He talks in depth about a Billy & Chuck style start to his wrestling career, ups, downs and a worrying bathroom story involving Tatanka! Sounds too good to miss, so let’s hear what Johnny had to say!
Tell us a little bit about how you got started in wrestling and who your influences were when you started watching it?
I used to constantly talk about wrestling to everyone who would listen, and then one day, a friend told me that a wrestling school, Mike Musso’s W3L, had just opened. I convinced about 10 of my friends to go with me and did my first session. The session was hard, but I fell in love with the rigour and intensity of it. By week 2, only one of my friends showed up with me. Then by week 5, I was the only one left. I trained twice a week, every week for over a year before making my debut. I was part of Mike’s first wave of trainees to debut on the Scottish circuit, which also included Kevin Williams (Kongo Kev at the time, he’ll love me for saying that!), ‘The Reaver’ Taylor Brydon and Siren Sara. There were others, but those are the 3 who are still performing today.
My early influence was most certainly the Ultimate Warrior, although that was when I still believed it was a competitive sport. When I learned how the bouts were really constructed, then I came to fully appreciate and idolise the likes of Shawn Michaels, Ric Flair and Mick Foley: Shawn for his technical gifts and charisma, Ric for the amazing heel persona that I wanted to emulate and Mick for his outright balls-to-the-wall, dare-devil mentality.
When did you decide that you wanted to be a wrestler?
From the moment I saw Big Daddy on World of Sport when I was five. I was the kid in primary school wrestling the other kids in the playground, and usually winning! When I was 18, I saw my first independent wrestling show while I was living in London. It featured the British Bulldog. I met Big Daddy’s brother, Max Crabtree, who agreed to train me if I went on the road and became part of the ring crew. Unfortunately, I had a bad knee injury at the time and was waiting to have a knee operation, but my passion never waned and years later, I was able to make my dream a reality.
For anyone that hasn’t seen you wrestle, how would you describe your style?
It actually depends if I’m working heel or face. I’ve worked as a heel for most of my career and tend to work an aggressive technical style, with lots of forearms and suplex variations. My peers would say that even as a heel, I can be a bit too flashy with my moves. I like to invent move variations that no one else does. As a face, I like to work a more Lucha style. I will do flying head scissors, hurracanrana’s, come off the top rope and do the occasional 619 if the fans want to see it. Regardless what style I’m working though, my greatest asset has always been my mouth and my charisma. I literally never shut up, whether I’m taunting the crowd or my opponent!
What’s the one thing that frustrates you about the world of wrestling right now?
Scottish wrestling is very divided up into territories and it can be a “who you know” rather than your talent that gets you noticed. I’d love to see more sharing of talent and less bitching between companies, however it is what it is and won’t change anytime soon. At least each company has some talented wrestlers on their roster.
There are lots of good, strong wrestling companies in the UK right now. What do you put that down to?
Passion and hard work. ICW has Mark Dallas, PBW has Ross Watson and SWE have Dave Lowe. They all work hard for their companies and have all seen success. Wrestlezone are owned by shareholders who all work incredibly hard. Being the new kids on the block hasn’t stopped them and they have seen increased attendances for every show they have done this year. Next year, they are holding a landmark show where, like SWE, they will bring in ex-WWE Superstars. The Scottish scene has never been hotter and it’s an honour to be part of it.
What are your memories of your first match?
Well, my first match was scheduled to be a squash match to a guy called Mr Invincible. Mr Invincible would squash Tommy Turner, Kongo Kev and then me. When we met him before the show, he basically told us we were getting our arses kicked for real and then if he saw us again, he might go easier on us. I have to admit that I was ready to run for it, but something inside me made me stay. The show was a sell out. They had an entrance way, an amazing sound system and a smoke machine. The problem with the smoke machine was that it was leaking and it left a puddle on the entrance way! My nerves were alleviated when, during his entrance, Mike Musso burst through the curtain with fire and passion, and slipped hilariously on his arse!
When it was my turn to make my entrance, the adrenaline rush and the roar of the crowd was like no other feeling I had ever had. We had been told backstage that the ring was not a proper wrestling ring: it was a converted boxing ring, and it had a metal support beam straight up the middle. We were warned not to take any bumps in the middle of the ring.
With that in mind, I entered the ring to take my squash. It was quick and brutal. First, I took a stiff clothesline, where I had no choice but to bump in the middle of the ring. That was followed by an open hand slap in the face that was so hard it split my lip in three places. To finish, Mr Invincible (who was around 30 stone in weight) power-slammed me in the middle of the ring. The pain was instant and left me with a badly bruised spine. However, it didn’t matter to me because that night, I had become a wrestler.
How tough was it when you were injured in your first match, suffering a bruised spine. At the time, did it put you off, or did you put it down to experience?
Well, in the same night, even with the injury, I had to take part in a battle royal. I expected much of the same treatment, but it was the exact opposite. Everyone in the ring took care of me and were careful not to hurt me. I realised that not every match would be like that, plus my passion for wrestling was at an all-time high after just realising my dream. After 3 months, I was ready to go again, this time being put in the tag-team “The Tenacious Guns”.
Tell us a little bit about the Tenacious Guns tag-team in W3L?
Most new wrestlers are brought in as baby faces. It’s the easiest way to learn with the heel leading the match. Mike was so impressed by our (me and Tommy Turner) heel work in training that he started us off as heels. Mike’s idea was to have us work as a pseudo gay tag-team. I think he wanted to push what I was comfortable with and we clashed on the character I was portraying a few times.
My only solace was that I got to choose my wrestling name, unlike Kongo Kev haha! We were instantly put in matches with the likes of Lionheart and Jack Jester, Los Pervitoes, T2K (Darkside and Wolfgang) and the mega hot (at the time) tag-team Fight Club. Our matches with Fight Club in W3L were getting a lot of attention, so Mark Dallas decided to let us feud with them in his new company, ICW.
Even in losing most of our matches, the W3L crowds were really starting to get behind us, so Mike decided to turn us face and defeat the champs Fight Club in our home town of Kirkcaldy. It was a gruelling match and at that time, it was my proudest moment. I was bloody and bruised by the end, but along with Tommy Turner, I held my first title, the W3L tag team titles, aloft to a raucous crowd. About 6 months later, I left W3L and Tommy continued on in the team “The Highland Guns” with Colin McKay.
Tommy lost his passion for the sport while in that team and retired, whereas I went on to solo success with other companies. I still enjoy tag-team wrestling to this day and I learned so much in that team. It was a real boon that Mike trusted us to work with such experienced competitors. It really was the best way to learn.
ICW has got a lot of coverage recently because of the quality of the shows they’ve been putting on. What was it like being there in the early days, wrestling against Fight Club amongst others?
I remember the first show I worked for Mark. We were in a triple-threat tag-team match against Los Pervitos and Fight Club. There had been a street fight match on just before ours and there were still broken light tubes and drawing pins all over the place. After my match, I had to get Kid Fight to pull some drawing pins and broken glass from my back.
In those early days, ICW struggled to pull more than 50 fans, but I loved the fact that Mark gave us full creative control of the match and just told us to perform at our best. Over the next few months, we clashed with Fight Club a few more times in hardcore and falls count anywhere matches. Our matches all got great reviews. We even got to beat Fight Club in ICW, with myself scoring the pin over Kid Fight. It was amazing to be part of those early days. It’s great to see Mark have such great success with ICW now. They do offer an adult alternative to the other family friendly wrestling shows of other companies. No-one thought that an adult orientated wrestling company could work, but Mark has proved them wrong.
It’s not often that we talk to wrestlers who’ve actually promoted and run their own shows. What was the final step that made you think “Yeah, I want to run my own shows”?
Well originally, I never intended to run my own shows. Me and my wife at the time decided to run wrestling-themed birthday parties. We spent all our savings, about 10 grand, and bought a unit and a ring among other things. There were a lot of people asking me to train them, but I didn’t feel experienced enough, so I brought other people in to help me, including Kevin Williams, Bravehart, Chaz Phoenix and Lionheart. We also ran guest seminars with the likes of Pac, Conscience and many more, so running shows was the next natural extension.
We called the company Wrestlezone. Someone recently said to me if I was to write a book about my life in wrestling I should entitle it “10 ways to lose a business and a marriage”. As much as I wanted to hit him when he said that, there is truth to it. Some people are built to run companies (i.e. Mark Dallas and Ross Watson) and some aren’t (myself).
The worst part of running your own shows is that you spend months trying to promote a show with little or no support, you put all your money into it and you have hardly anyone show up. Yes, I had some successes, but I’ve also had a lot of failures. When you have zero money left, but still have to find money to pay the venue etc, it’s pretty stressful. In the end, after nearly two years of running Wrestlezone, the financial hardships ended my marriage. If I had continued running Wrestlezone, then I risked having our ring possessed, which would have ended the company. I was forced to sell something I loved to save it.
To this day, I don’t think many people realise how hard it was for me to do that. I nearly quit wrestling. However, I’m very proud that Wrestlezone now has a clear focus and is going from strength to strength. I take comfort in the fact that a promotion I started is now in its 5th year and getting stronger. To answer your original question about running my own shows, well it would be fun if money was no object, but I would never want that stress again. I’m happy to have given some performers their start and take pride in seeing them succeed.
You got involved in SWE about 4 years ago. What made you want to work there?
Dave and Chaz (aka Bravehart and Chaz Phoenix) contacted me early in Wrestlezone’s life. A lot of people will say bad stuff about them, but they were a great help to me in the early days of the company. They provided SWE workers for the early Wrestlezone shows, which helped us out a lot. I had met Dave a few years earlier while doing a cross promotion show with W3L. Dave liked my work and saw potential in the Wrestlezone trainees, so he offered me the chance to work in his company. Working for SWE gave me a new focus and Dave allowed me to portray the character I wanted and gave me full freedom to just put on great matches.
In the 4 years I have worked for SWE, Dave and Chaz have given me opportunities to work with WWE superstars and I’ve earned 3 titles since I’ve been here. Wrestlezone and SWE are now very separate companies, but there is no doubt that Wrestlezone probably wouldn’t have survived the first year without SWE and SWE probably would not have attained the success it now has without the Wrestlezone workers.
I’ve spoken to a lot of guys from SWE over the last few months and they always talk about you as someone who’s great to get in the ring with and learn from. How does that make you feel, especially given that you’ve worked pretty much all over Scotland?
There can be no greater compliment to me than to hear fellow workers talk that way about me. I always give 120 percent in the ring and everybody who works with me knows that it’s going to be an intense match against me. It’s great to hear that other workers feel I bring the best out in them. It makes me feel great and to keep delivering the best matches I can for as long as I can.
Over the last few years, the SWE have managed to get some WWE legends at their shows like Ted DiBiase, Virgil, Tatanka and most recently, Chavo Guerrero. What’s it like to be around those guys backstage and are they generous with their time to the boys in the back?
Over the years, I’ve had a lot of interaction with Ted. One year, I was lucky enough to be one of the workers to tour with him around Scotland, performing matches in front of him. I could listen to Ted all day; he really is an amazing person.
I want to share a funny story here about when I first met Tatanka. At the first Hell for Lycra show that Tatanka worked, I was on my way to the toilet. When I made it there, I immediately recognised Tatanka. I tried not to mark out and greeted him by his real name (Chris) and said what an honour it was to meet him. We shook hands and he cracked a couple of jokes. The conversation ended and I turned round to do my business, only Tatanka keeps cracking his jokes. Now, I’m a typical bloke who can’t do two things at once, so I’m nervously laughing while trying to do my business, only it’s not happening!
10 uncomfortable minutes pass and I’m still unsuccessfully trying to do my business while listening to Tatanka’s jokes. He suddenly stopped talking, looked at what I was still holding, then back at me. He gave me a quick nod, then left without saying another word! It was really embarrassing! Every time I saw him on the show after that, I just put my head down and kept walking! At this year’s Hell for Lycra, he was talking away to me, so hopefully he’s forgotten about that now!
The legends are very generous with their time and I can’t wait to have more interactions with them at next years Hell for Lycra and Wrestlezone’s Aberdeen Anarchy 5.
Tell us a little bit about the in-ring promo you cut with the legendary Million Dollar Man Ted DiBiase?
On the day of the second Hell for Lycra that Ted was featured on, about 2 hours before the show was due to start, Dave pulled me aside and asked if I’d like to cut a promo on Ted. I was like “hell yeah!”, so Dave asked me to follow him to talk it over with Ted.
Dave says to Ted: “Do you remember that promo you did with your son on Raw a few months ago?” Ted’s like “Yeah I remember it, that was fun!” and he laughs that laugh only Ted can do! Dave laughs and so do I. Dave then says: “Do you remember that slap you gave him?” Ted laughs again and says: “Yeah man, I slapped him so hard that he couldn’t open his mouth right for a month!”
We all laugh with Ted again. Dave then points at me and says: “Can you do that to him tonight?” Ted responds with: “Sure I can! I’ll slap him even harder for you Dave!” The laughter rings out again, only this time, not from me! Ted pulls me aside and says “OK son, don’t worry. I’m gonna slap you real hard, but you just clamp your jaw and you’ll be fine!”
I didn’t plan the promo. I decided to stay with the themes that he was old and past it and had no right to be in the ring with the youth of the business. There were around 600 fans there and, to date, it’s the best promo I’ve ever done. I said the final line before the inevitable slap. Even clamping my jaw didn’t prepare me. The slap rung out over the entire venue and was met with a massive ovation. I legit saw stars and lay there dazed. What an amazing moment! I had a massive red hand mark for on my face for hours, but who cares? I’d just been in the ring with, and slapped by, the Million Dollar Man!
Of all the matches you’ve had in your career so far, which one stands out to you most and which one are you most proud of?
It has to be the match I had with Rory McAllister. Rory’s an ex-WWE Superstar from the tag-team The Highlanders. At that time, I was the SWE Heavyweight champion. That year was the first Hell for Lycra show to feature WWE superstars and included the debut of The Million Dollar Man. It was a massive honour to be chosen to be in the main-event with someone as experienced as Rory. There was also a lot of pressure, as I knew Ted would be watching the match and I wondered if I could perform at that level.
During the show, I got to share a separate locker room with Rory and Ted. Being in there was so surreal; I just sat there and listened. Rory was such a cool guy. We planned the match and he even gave me a place in the match where I would call my own spot. He warned me though that there was going to be one particular clothesline that he would hit stiff. He told me that even Bob Holly hated taking it!
I was the heel that night. I cut a quick promo in the ring about how I’m actually English, even though I have a broad Scottish accent, and that Scotland sucks. Rory comes out to bagpipes (because he’s actually Scottish) to a massive ovation. The ring was shaking because of the noise when he came out! The match went ahead as planned and I was going toe to toe with a WWE superstar! The moment of the clothesline approached, so I took it as planned. It was a little too high though and it caught me straight in the throat. I went to the outside as planned and my throat swelled up instantly. I carried on, got back in the ring and continued the match, even calling my own spot. The planned finish was a DQ win to protect my title and to give the fans a babyface winner. When I went through the curtain, Ted was stood there and said “great match kid!”
It just doesn’t get any better than that. Rory thanked me for the match after and bought me a pint to help my swollen throat. I couldn’t swallow properly for a month, but I was elated!
Who’s been your favourite opponent to get in the ring with and why?
I’ve been lucky to be in the ring with many great wrestlers over the years, but it has to be Scotty Swift. Scotty has unmatched passion and charisma. He really knows how to sell and work a crowd; he’s a real story teller. When I know I’m facing him in the ring, I always want to up my work rate.
Arguably our best match was for SWE in Cupar. It was the SWE’s debut in a new venue, so Dave and Chaz wanted to make a good impression. Scotty and I were in the opener and we were told to give a bit extra to the crowd. We entered to near silence and the audience seemed very shy, but we put on such a performance that at the end, the whole crowd were going wild! In my opinion, Scotty Swift is one of the best babyface workers around at the moment and I hope that I get to work with him again in future.
Who would you say is the most under-rated wrestler you’ve been in the ring with?
This is a tough one because there’s quite a few. In SWE, Martin Stallyon, Ian Ambrose and Mr News have made huge strides in the last few years, but outside of SWE, they don’t get that recognition. EG Mackie is another amazing talent who can be overlooked.
After a lot of thinking though, I have to go for the worker known as Damien. He primarily works Wrestlezone and SWE and he’s simply amazing. Whether he is working as a face or a heel, he always brings it. I can honestly say I’ve never had a bad match with him. He’s worked as a tag team partner of mine, as well as an opponent, many times. I’ve watched him go toe to toe with the likes of BT Gunn and Lionheart. Damien can have a good match with anyone and I genuinely get very excited when I know I’m working with him. It’s just a pity that the rest of Scotland don’t realise it yet.
Is there anyone you haven’t had the chance to wrestle yet that you’d love to work with?
Again there’s more than one, but I’m going to go with Chris Renfrew. I was scheduled to work with him last year in a falls count anywhere street fight. I was pretty nervous, but I was pumped up for it. Two days before the match, the venue cancelled the show. I was gutted. Hopefully it can be rescheduled for next year because I’m looking forward to seeing what kind of hardcore carnage we can bring!
Let’s pretend for a second that I’m Vince McMahon. I call you up and say “I want to give you a match at Wrestlemania against any wrestler in the world, from the recent past or present”. Who would you want to face on that stage and why?
It would have to be The Rock. I love how the Rock always talks trash before, during and after his matches. I would love to match my charisma and trash talking with his, it would be amazing!
And finally, have you got a message for all your fans?
A bit cheesy but true, always follow your dreams. If you are determined enough it will happen for you.
I think I can speak for everyone when I say that Johnny’s interview was completely different to anything I’ve done so far. There was so much different stuff to cover and so many different experiences to share that I reckon I could’ve sat with Johnny for a good few hours and still not had time to cover everything he’s done in wrestling-land! At some stage, we might well sit down again for another chat, but I’ll sort that out when the champ has the time to talk to me again! Haha..
Just like I mentioned above, Johnny is set to defend his Future Division championship tonight in Dundee in a “Title vs Hair” match with Martyn Stallyon. For ticket information on the show, as well as Saturday’s “Season’s Beatings” event in Alyth, please visit www.sweonline.co.uk or like the Official SWE Online Facebook page at www.facebook.com/sweonline.
I’ll bring yet another SWE Spotlight interview to all of you next week, but no clues as to who it’s going to shine on! You’ll need to keep checking to find out!
Thanks for reading.
George
SLTD Wrestling's resident Scottish Nightmare. Some of my content may not be suitable for younger readers or those who are easily offended!
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